I Have been learning about various systems theories over the last two years and it is a massive field.
Starting of with a general theory of systems all the way to the present. The practical use cases are immense. Complex adaptive systems is just one of the many perspectives.
Reading the post it seems the assumption is “the system” can be controlled with the “requisite variety”. This is very much a hard systems stance. Useful when people are not involved, and to keep variables within an acceptable range.
The soft systems perspective is very different, rather than viewing the system as out there in the world it begins with the assumption that the system is actually a construction in our heads.
With different people operating from different mental models of the system. Differences and tensions stem from this.
Rather than being a negative this diversity is actually a positive as one can see a More holistic picture of “the system”, the tensions between perspectives on the system are opportunities for creativity and innovation.
Put another way. In the soft systems view, the system is actually the process of inquiry. The inquiry process defines the system in our minds. Thus, it is a process of learning that is recursive.
> With different people operating from different mental models of the system.
But doesn't this take us full circle. If we start admitting that everyone has a different subjective model, and if we want to deal with this fact, then we have a whole population of subjective models "out there" in the world being part of "the system".
Interesting! Yes, I've never considered a "soft system" view as you mention.
Thank you.
Pardon my ignorance, but the soft system approach sounds a lot like Psychology and Sociology(psychology applied to more than one person). How are they different?
Great insight. Soft systems approach understands that all social systems fundamentally contain people, who act within the system. In other words, meaning is created within ourselves (psychology), and within a social context(sociology). SSM is an approach to understanding the various internal representations or mental models (psychology), and gain shared understanding (sociology)
If you can only read one book, get Sterman's Business Dynamics.
The original hardback is out of print and so new ones are hideously expensive, but there are affordable second-hand copies and cheap "international" editions have popped up lately.
It would depend in what scenario you wanted to apply the concepts. I find that the best ROT (return on time) can be had by reading research papers. You need to have an understanding of the terminology or be prepared to slog through it. There are some books that have very useful information.
Below are some of the resources i have been using/used:
A brilliant introduction to systems thinking by John Sterman who is a legend in the field.
Books focused on Application of the theory, with various approaches to systems thinking that can be applied to solve challenges. There is some overlap between the two books below as they both have a catalogue of methods. They are categorized differently. I would read the introductory chapters of both of these and then review the chapter layout and see which of the two i prefer.
Systems Thinking: Creative Holism for Managers by Michael C. Jackson
A brief guide to interactive planning and idealized design by Russel Ackoff
Application of soft systems methodology to the real world process of teaching and learning by Nandish V. Patel
An Application of Checkland’s Soft Systems Methodology to the Development of a Military Information Operations Capability for the Australian Defence Force by R. J. Staker
Defining innovation: Using soft systems methodology to approach the complexity of innovation in educational technology by Glenda Cox
The viable system model: A briefing about organisational structure by Raul Espejo
Complex Adaptive Systems by JASON BROWNLEE
Sustainability, complexity and learning: insights from complex systems approaches by A. Espinosa, T. Porter
Stafford Beer’s Viable System Model An Interpretation By Trevor Hilder
Principles of the self-organizing system by W. Ross Ashby
Guidance on applying the viable system model by Sandra Hildbrand Shamim Bodhanya
Embracing Human Experience in Applied Systems-Thinking by José-Rodrigo Córdoba-Pachón
The Need for a Systemic Approach to Change Management—A Case Study by Guangming Cao, Steve Clarke and Brian Lehaney
I have just included titles and authors, not direct download links to the PDF as unsure about copyrights. Some of my copies of the PDF are stamped with the date-time i downloaded. My email is in my profile if you want more.
No worries, I can manage to find books, if I ever need one I'll ping you.
And about the application, I was mostly curious about social dynamics. For instance how to model society in order to find weak points (Donella Meadows talks about the idea IIRC) in order to restructure/migrate population lifestyles smooth and fast towards better ones (energy use, social tissue, health etc).
I've always thought complex systems explained a lot of the world (ironically, how little we know!) and I've found it to be a great mental model for understanding the world.
Every once in a while I find a site like yours that has conveniently aggregated a ton of stray thoughts and expands my world a little bit. Just wanted to take a moment to say thanks for doing this
Systems thinking is better used as an oblique strategy to drive inspiration than as a formal discipline. Often the conclusions rest on assumptions & axioms that even practicing statisticians would feel queasy about.
This is something I struggled with a lot. Internal me would scream, show me the numbers!!. But when I go into mathematical modelling, too many assumptions make the model very.. basic. (Like you say)
However, if you aren't trying to control the system, but merely influence it - this helps figure out the leverage points, and what will happen with perturbations on said leverage points.
As far as understanding a system goes, that is good enough to use it to your advantage.
A formal discipline gets detached from reality (mathematical modelling). This I think rests somewhere in the middle.
Starting of with a general theory of systems all the way to the present. The practical use cases are immense. Complex adaptive systems is just one of the many perspectives.
Reading the post it seems the assumption is “the system” can be controlled with the “requisite variety”. This is very much a hard systems stance. Useful when people are not involved, and to keep variables within an acceptable range.
The soft systems perspective is very different, rather than viewing the system as out there in the world it begins with the assumption that the system is actually a construction in our heads.
With different people operating from different mental models of the system. Differences and tensions stem from this.
Rather than being a negative this diversity is actually a positive as one can see a More holistic picture of “the system”, the tensions between perspectives on the system are opportunities for creativity and innovation.
Put another way. In the soft systems view, the system is actually the process of inquiry. The inquiry process defines the system in our minds. Thus, it is a process of learning that is recursive.